[Jukebox-list] Wurlitzer 2410S problem

Don dontutt at telus.net
Fri May 25 16:25:48 PDT 2007 

Steve,

Or you could break the face off the blown fusetron and maybe grab each side 
of its internal wiring with an alligator clip..... thence to the meter.
Or, if the fusetron is what I think it is, it has a screw base like a light 
bulb......  if so... :-) .... just take a small light bulb, break it, remove 
the filament, screw it into the fusetron holder, hook your ammeter to the 
filament tower leads...... maybe.....  saves time digging into the back 
workings of the fuseholder if they are hard to get into....
Don


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Wahl" <steve at pro-ns.net>
To: "Jukebox mailing list" <jukebox-list at lists.netlojix.com>
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 11:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Jukebox-list] Wurlitzer 2410S problem


> Don,
>
> Good point.
>
> I still think I'll go with a visual inspection, first; but if I have
> problems figuring out what went wrong, I'll keep the ammeter in mind.
>
> I think I have to open it up far enough to get at the back of the fuse
> holder in order to insert an ammeter inline anyway, right?
>
> --> Steve
>
> On Fri, May 25, 2007 at 11:05:17AM -0700, Don wrote:
>> Steve,
>> Not to grind away at my idea, but......
>> if an  overheating problem is what you are trying to track down, then
>> having the ammeter in circuit WILL let you see the differences in current
>> draw, if any, for each selection.
>> Obviously, should one of the selections show a considerably larger 
>> current
>> draw, then that is one selector circuit leg to check further.....
>> ;-)
>> don
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Steve Wahl" <steve at pro-ns.net>
>> To: "Jukebox mailing list" <jukebox-list at lists.netlojix.com>
>> Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 10:53 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Jukebox-list] Wurlitzer 2410S problem
>>
>>
>> >Ron and Don,
>> >
>> >Thanks for the suggestions.
>> >
>> >As far as blowing the fuse, though: after replacing the fuse, I did
>> >try *all* 100 of the selections to see which selection pins popped up;
>> >and fully expected the fuse might blow again.  That was using the 1/2
>> >amp slo-blow, and it didn't blow.  I might try again, just to be sure,
>> >before I take the selectors off and examine.
>> >
>> >There's a lot of questions in my mind that I could ask, but most
>> >require me to go back to the juke and see if I'm remembering things
>> >correctly -- and I'm not at home right now.  Here's one I'll go with
>> >anyway:
>> >
>> >I believe when the selectors are propperly at rest, if you manually
>> >press on one of the solenoid plungers, it should pop up a 3 or 8 pin.
>> >Is that right?
>> >
>> >I think the whole plate may now be resting in the wrong position, so a
>> >1 or 6 pops up, but like I said, I have to go back and check.
>> >
>> >Thanks again,
>> >
>> >--> Steve
>> >
>> >On Fri, May 25, 2007 at 09:16:56AM -0700, Don wrote:
>> >>Steve,
>> >>Instead of blowing lots of fuses during your testing, why not put an
>> >>ammeter in place of the fuse? That way you can see how much current is
>> >>being drawn.
>> >>...... unless the pros around here think this is a bad idea.....
>> >>
>> >>Only reason I can think of that this is a bad idea is if you leave the
>> >>power on too long after detecting the over/current, OR you don't select 
>> >>a
>> >>high enough Amp range on the meter and risk meter damage.
>> >>Good luck,
>> >>Don
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>----- Original Message ----- 
>> >>From: "Ron Rich" <ronnnrich at yahoo.com>
>> >>To: "Jukebox mailing list" <jukebox-list at lists.netlojix.com>
>> >>Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 8:55 AM
>> >>Subject: Re: [Jukebox-list] Wurlitzer 2410S problem
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>>Steve,
>> >>> Depending on the size of that "blown" fuse, you may, or may not have
>> >>>burned a coil-
>> >>> ALWAYS opt for a fuse of a lesser value, when the correct one is not
>> >>>available. "Fusetron" was (is?) the trademarked name the Bussman Fuse
>> >>>Company owns, for "SloBlo" type fuses. Other companies also make
>> >>>SloBlows--no problem. 8/10 fuses are still being made--I have them if
>> >>>you
>> >>>can't find one elsewhere.
>> >>> To remove the selector, there are silk screened instructions as to
>> >>> which
>> >>>two bolts to remove--and NOT to remove, on the mounting bracket. This 
>> >>>is
>> >>>also shown in most Wurly service manuals. Also, if you don't have the
>> >>>alignment tool (usually attatched to the cabinet side in a "spring
>> >>>clip"),
>> >>>you can use a # 2 Phillips screw driver in it's place. But first, make
>> >>>all
>> >>>selections using all of the numbers, then the letters, and see if the
>> >>>.05
>> >>>blows--then you'll know whch coil is bad. (ie: make selection  using 
>> >>>the
>> >>>"A" and each number--then using any number, make selections  using the
>> >>>rest of the letters--take a few seconds time between the selections, 
>> >>>as
>> >>>you will "heat up" that .05 A. fuse, and it will let go--).
>> >>> Ron Rich
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>Steve Wahl <steve at pro-ns.net> wrote:
>> >>> Hi, everyone. Two questions burried in a bunch of !@#$ below:
>> >>>
>> >>>My 2410S was left on for a few hours the other day when I wasn't home,
>> >>>and it reportedly started to smell hot, and my wife shut it off.
>> >>>
>> >>>When I got to it, there were three letter buttons held down, no
>> >>>numbers though. (The machine is exposed to toddlers...) My wife
>> >>>didn't notice them, the buttons may even have been push down after the
>> >>>incident occurred.
>> >>>
>> >>>There may have been credit established at the time; I'm also not sure
>> >>>about that. I have it set to 7 selections per coin, whether dime or
>> >>>quarter, as a compromise between coin operation and free play; because
>> >>>of this it does sit there with credit established at times. However,
>> >>>we usually power it off when it's not actively being played.
>> >>>
>> >>>Here's what I found when I looked at it:
>> >>>
>> >>>Looking at the fuses, I found one blown fuse. It was supposed to be
>> >>>an 8/10 amp fuestron, it's the one directly on the selector assembly,
>> >>>not down in the junction box, etc. I believe fusetron is what the
>> >>>label next to the fuse said; that's a brand of slow-blow fuse, right?
>> >>>The fuse that was there was a regular, single thin wire fuse. I
>> >>>didn't think to check its rating; it was a thin wire so I don't think
>> >>>it was overfused by much if at all. (Still have the blown fuse, I'll
>> >>>check it later). The wire still remained, but there is black residue
>> >>>on the glass near the break -- looks more like a short than a slight
>> >>>overload I think.
>> >>>
>> >>>QUESTION ONE: My local hardware store doesn't seem to have 0.8 A
>> >>>fuses anymore! I have my choice between 1 A and 0.5 A; slow blow or
>> >>>not. I put a 0.5 A slow blow in there for now. Does that seem like a
>> >>>reasonable long-term solution?
>> >>>
>> >>>I tried manually tripping a selection finger, the selection played
>> >>>just fine.
>> >>>
>> >>>Since I suspected the selection system, I turned off the mech motor,
>> >>>and went to the front; and using the free-play switch, I walked
>> >>>through and selected all the selections. First thing to note is that
>> >>>some of them sounded normal, others sounded different; I'll describe
>> >>>that in a bit. Then I went back and peered at the pins. Sure enough,
>> >>>only certain ones selected.
>> >>>
>> >>>The ones that popped up were 1, 3, 6, and 8 for each letter. And 2's,
>> >>>4's, 7's, and 9's made a longer/louder "buzz" than usual when I
>> >>>selected them. 5's and 0's made a different, but not quite right
>> >>>sound.
>> >>>
>> >>>As I type this I realize I'm missing some information, like I should
>> >>>have made a selection, looked at what finger tripped, and reset it
>> >>>before I go on to try the next selection; because as it is, I don't
>> >>>know if the ones that supposedly worked actually selected the right
>> >>>selection, nor do I know if the ones that didn't work selected
>> >>>nothing, or would pop the wrong pin.
>> >>>
>> >>>So I'm not asking you guys to make a diagnosis from that information,
>> >>>especially from the description of the sounds it's making. :-)
>> >>>
>> >>>I'm also away from my manual as I type this, so forgive me if I screw
>> >>>up a few terms here...
>> >>>
>> >>>I suspect that my problem lies in the solenoids/coils/etc. that
>> >>>rotate the plate with the rockers on it. I assume that I'm going to
>> >>>want to take the selection assembly off of the mechanism to examine
>> >>>it. I want to make sure I read the manual right, to avoid alignment
>> >>>problems. So,
>> >>>
>> >>>QUESTION TWO: To remove the selection assembly but maintain alignment,
>> >>>I want to remove the three hex-head bolts from the bottom, but leave
>> >>>the nearby phillips head screws alone. Did I get that right?
>> >>>
>> >>>Right now, I'm thinking I'll find some insulation melted and something
>> >>>shorted, due to the reported smell (which does still linger), together
>> >>>with the fast-blow fuse blowing. I don't think a quick short would
>> >>>have heated up to give this much of a smell before blowing such a
>> >>>small fuse.
>> >>>
>> >>>Anyway, answers to the two questions, offers of additional insight,
>> >>>and wishes of good luck would all be greatly appreciated!
>> >>>
>> >>>--> Steve
>> >>>
>> >>>-- 
>> >>>Steve Wahl steve at pro-ns.net
>> >>>_______________________________________________
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>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
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>> >-- 
>> >Steve Wahl    steve at pro-ns.net
>> >
>> >I write to make people think. Sadly, in many cases my writing makes
>> >people think, "Man, this guy is really an idiot".
>> >  -- Nizo, on Slashdot
>> >
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>
> -- 
> Steve Wahl    steve at pro-ns.net
>
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